• crusa187@lemmy.ml
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    9 months ago

    UBI, single payer, and free college for all. Yes we can, and absolutely should!

    • lennybird@lemmy.world
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      9 months ago

      Is the verdict really in on UBI? Hasn’t the concern been it would be equivalent to the school voucher coupons and justified to gut a wide variety of social services in the end resulting in less net-benefit to the working class?

      • dejected_warp_core@lemmy.world
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        9 months ago

        I honestly don’t know, but that kinda/sorta makes sense on the face of it. UBI would throw everyone at the mercy of the “free market” for social services, and yes, could have the unintended consequence of obsolescing the state funded ones. Without adequate controls for services (regulations) it could get ugly. Especially if you consider that for-profit “healthcare”, as we enjoy it in the US today, covers most of these services we’re talking about.

        • Wogi@lemmy.world
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          9 months ago

          UBI is a bandaid, and not a very good one.

          Sure, having more money absolutely makes life easier. I’m not disputing that and no one with any sense would. But it doesn’t address the numerous problems it seeks to.

          But you touched on the problem, adequate controls are needed. We can do adequate controls without UBI.

          The problem with UBI is that when you do big payouts like that, they just become a target for price gouging. Everyone knows there’s extra money to be had and they’re going to want their cut. Your landlord is going to know exactly how much extra you’re making and without rent control there’s nothing stopping him from taking it. The best way to prevent that is to force him to compete for tenants.

          So wait, why isn’t he competing for tenants now?

          Additional housing fixes the rent problem. UBI puts a temporary bandaid on it.

          Universal healthcare fixes the medical expenses problem, strong unionization fixes the wages problem.

          Don’t get me wrong I’d love the paycheck, but it isn’t the solution people think it is.

          • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
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            9 months ago

            The problem with UBI is that when you do big payouts like that, they just become a target for price gouging.

            If you have robust laws preventing price gouging, that is not a problem. No one serious is suggesting implementing UBI with no framework around it.

            Incidentally, Alaska has a universal basic income in the form of oil dividends every year and there’s no evidence it’s led to price gouging as far as I know.

            • Wogi@lemmy.world
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              9 months ago

              A few thousand dollars a year is an order of magnitude different than a few thousand dollars a month. Shits already expensive in Alaska because it’s remote.

              Incidentally a handful of studies are several orders of magnitude different than actual UBI, and would similarly fail to showcase the problem.

                • Wogi@lemmy.world
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                  9 months ago

                  Robust laws also prevent the need for UBI in the first place. If we can’t figure out how to run a society without it, slapping UBI on top of that isn’t actually going to fix anything.

                  • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
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                    9 months ago

                    You’re making no sense. How is giving everyone the financial help to keep them clothed, housed, fed, etc. without needing to work for it not going to fix anything as long as you prevent price gouging?

          • cqst@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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            9 months ago

            Universal Basic Income reduced child poverty by 30%.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_tax_credit#United_States

            By making the child tax credit non-refundable it is effectively a Negative Income Tax which is a form of UBI.

            ‘Additional housing fixes the rent problem. UBI puts a temporary bandaid on it. Universal healthcare fixes the medical expenses problem, strong unionization fixes the wages problem. Don’t get me wrong I’d love the paycheck, but it isn’t the solution people think it is.’

            All of your points misunderstand what the goal of UBI is. By guaranteeing that everyone earns a certain amount of income, the government is garaunteeing a basic standard of living. So a CTC of $3600 means that everyone is guaranteeed an income of at least $3600.

            At first, there will be an inital raise in prices as a UBI will likely increases aggregate demand which will increase prices, but eventually prices would stabilize.

            Of course, this only helps people with children right now, and there are barriers to filing a tax return in the United States. But the laws could be change to expand the credit, and it’s completely possible for the United States to implement return free filing.

      • ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world
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        9 months ago

        Issue with UBI that it can be distorted so much it could mean almost anything at this point. AI corpos think UBI is when you buy their stocks early on, before the big AI boom (FOMO).

    • Boop2133@lemmy.world
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      9 months ago

      My only thing on UBI is who will disperse it? Our own government can’t because it would be used as a tool of leverage against us and they would always threaten to take it away.

      • gedaliyah@lemmy.world
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        9 months ago

        Yes, exactly as they constantly threaten to take away our Social Security, roads and military protection! /s

        • Captain Janeway@lemmy.world
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          9 months ago

          I don’t understand. They do take away our social security and roads. DoD is strong though but it doesn’t really function in service of us.