Whatever man if you care more about macroeconomics than actually helping people that’s a pretty sociopathic take. We could easily pay for a ubi with tax reform and it is one of those things that generates more money than we put into it, but what do I know, I’m someone you assume is an idiot.
Whatever man if you care more about macroeconomics than actually helping people that’s a pretty sociopathic take.
If you think you can help people at a national scale without macroeconomics then you are a moron.
We could easily pay for a ubi with tax reform
Again, under the original premise tax reform would already be occurring to pay for people’s basic needs…you know, the thing that UBI is supposed to partially cover.
it is one of those things that generates more money than we put into i
In our current economy…not in one where people’s basic needs are already being met.
The theory of UBI generating more money than it cost relies on the fact that covering some people’s basic needs increases their productivity. In the economic theory we were talking about their needs would already be fully covered. Meaning there wouldn’t be an increase in productivity, meaning UBI would not generate more money than it cost.
but what do I know, I’m someone you assume is an idiot.
In all fairness, what you are claiming is pretty idiotic.
Even in communist countries where people’s most basic needs are fully covered by the government, they don’t the receiver free checks from the government, in fact in most of them it’s illegal to be unemployed for long periods. Arguably productivity is even more important in planned and centralized economies, and a UBI with a socialized system would just motivate people not to work.
That’s pretty fucking stupid since people worked on stuff outside of subsistence farming well before money existed. You’re so wrapped up in how things are and how you think things should work you’re not seeing anything potential. In your bleak worldview humanity must enslave itself. Maybe if you had a perspective that was more focused on the happiness and well-being of humans you could use that oh-so-massive big brain of yours to figure out a way for people to have their needs met and have a functioning society, but your motivations are clearly set in a different direction.
That’s pretty fucking stupid since people worked on stuff outside of subsistence farming well before money existed.
Economics existed before capitalism… Macroeconomics does not solely consist of the evaluation of currency. You can do a modern economic evaluation of subsistence farming communities, or a historical macroeconomic evaluation of previous societies.
Macroeconomics studies large scale forces of the economy, like a population’s effect on productivity, labor policy, government type, taxation, or even how weather will affect food growth.
In your bleak worldview humanity must enslave itself.
Lol, even in economies where people equally own the means of production, individual people still have to be productive…
You are just a lazy ass who wants to receive the benefits of a socially and economically equitable society without labouring for it.
figure out a way for people to have their needs met and have a functioning society, but your motivations are clearly set in a different direction.
I started this conversation by arguing we should have a system that already insured our needs were met… You just want your needs met and then extra money so you can be a lazy ass and not contribute anything to society.
UBI is a scam that billionaires put forward because they know cutting a check for 500 bucks every month is a hell of a lot cheaper alternative than providing food, education, housing, and healthcare.
Maybe learn a iota about the economy before you start gargling Andrew Yang’s ballsack…
Like I said before, amazing how people will argue against their better interests.
Lol, arguing something will not work because it disregards very simple economic principles is not “arguing against my own interests”.
Really bold of you to assume I’m just lazy, too.
I mean, you’re obviously too lazy to apply yourself to learn basic concepts…so yeah, lazy asshole.
It’s really funny that you got this bent out of shape when someone just asks “why not both”
My dude, dunking on lazy idiots online is fun…
Ah well can’t help everyone, especially when they won’t bother trying, right?
The irony… Coming from the idiot who thinks we could provide housing, medical care, education, food and give everyone $500 a month by just by changing taxes…
Considering how the government spends money on so much other shit
Again… You have no idea what you are talking about, and have no clue how much healthcare cost.
The federal government’s largest expense is social security (22%), Medicare (14%), and Medicaid(10%). That’s nearly half of the entire federal budget to cover some of the cost of living and healthcare for a minority of the country.
Granted our system is wasteful and inefficient, but not to the point where we wouldn’t have to vastly increase revenue to cover the entire populations healthcare, food, housing and education. We would have to reshape the entire economy to do so, and I think there is a moral imperative to do so. However, once that is accomplished, I do not see a reason to implement UBI, a plan that would just further increase the need for revenue that’s already being spent for better purposes.
I already explained why UBI would not stimulate the economy under a the economic conditions we were discussing. There’s a reason no communist country has implemented a UBI. You are just too dense to actually understand anything we’re talking about. You don’t even understand the reason UBI is a scam in our current economic system let alone a hypothetical one.
not last, I’m just gonna take advice from someone who probably stabs homeless people.
Lol, I advocate for universal housing, education, nutrition, and healthcare… But because you don’t understand basic economics, it means I want to murder homeless people?
Also I imagine you meant to say "I’m not lazy, I’m just not gonna take advice…?
It’s almost like you’re too lazy to even read your own responses…
You were so wrapped up in the current situation that your very limited imagination couldn’t comprehend changing it, and you’re myopically focused on the world as it is instead of what it could be. I can understand someone who isn’t very creative having a hard time thinking outside of what’s put in front of them, so I’m sorry I was trying to introduce a hypothetical that was so over your head that you clearly got frustrated with the situation.
You were clearly thinking from a “how could we work this ass things are” situation because of your mental limitations, and I was casually thinking of hypotheticals and being goal first oriented, thinking of the optional situation and willing to work backwards.
So yes, of course my cavalier suggestion wouldn’t work in the economic system we have now, and since you’re not really able to look outside of that, you, like a frustrated child, see it as an impossibility and lashed out.
I think it would certainly be a noble goal and something to work towards, humanity having it’s basic needs met with a small stipend on top of that, and what a pity there’s people who would fight tooth and nail against such an idealized situation.
I suppose you’re very much wrapped up in the puritanical thought of life without work is sinful and should be avoided, especially with your repeated accusations of laziness directed at me, so such a future would be a nightmare for you. I only assume you never plan on retirement and view retired people with contempt for their lack of toil. It’s why I assume you wish to stab homeless people, for their sloth. You say you’re for nationalized education, housing, good and healthcare but honestly I don’t think your heart is in it if one of your big arguments against ubi is the same one being used against all those things, the horrible idea that some people might not work when they could.
Ah well, have fun working towards humanity having to do perpetual labor forever, I’m sure that’s a great idea. Wouldn’t want too many idle hands and all.
Whatever man if you care more about macroeconomics than actually helping people that’s a pretty sociopathic take. We could easily pay for a ubi with tax reform and it is one of those things that generates more money than we put into it, but what do I know, I’m someone you assume is an idiot.
If you think you can help people at a national scale without macroeconomics then you are a moron.
Again, under the original premise tax reform would already be occurring to pay for people’s basic needs…you know, the thing that UBI is supposed to partially cover.
In our current economy…not in one where people’s basic needs are already being met.
The theory of UBI generating more money than it cost relies on the fact that covering some people’s basic needs increases their productivity. In the economic theory we were talking about their needs would already be fully covered. Meaning there wouldn’t be an increase in productivity, meaning UBI would not generate more money than it cost.
In all fairness, what you are claiming is pretty idiotic.
Even in communist countries where people’s most basic needs are fully covered by the government, they don’t the receiver free checks from the government, in fact in most of them it’s illegal to be unemployed for long periods. Arguably productivity is even more important in planned and centralized economies, and a UBI with a socialized system would just motivate people not to work.
That’s pretty fucking stupid since people worked on stuff outside of subsistence farming well before money existed. You’re so wrapped up in how things are and how you think things should work you’re not seeing anything potential. In your bleak worldview humanity must enslave itself. Maybe if you had a perspective that was more focused on the happiness and well-being of humans you could use that oh-so-massive big brain of yours to figure out a way for people to have their needs met and have a functioning society, but your motivations are clearly set in a different direction.
Economics existed before capitalism… Macroeconomics does not solely consist of the evaluation of currency. You can do a modern economic evaluation of subsistence farming communities, or a historical macroeconomic evaluation of previous societies.
Macroeconomics studies large scale forces of the economy, like a population’s effect on productivity, labor policy, government type, taxation, or even how weather will affect food growth.
Lol, even in economies where people equally own the means of production, individual people still have to be productive…
You are just a lazy ass who wants to receive the benefits of a socially and economically equitable society without labouring for it.
I started this conversation by arguing we should have a system that already insured our needs were met… You just want your needs met and then extra money so you can be a lazy ass and not contribute anything to society.
UBI is a scam that billionaires put forward because they know cutting a check for 500 bucks every month is a hell of a lot cheaper alternative than providing food, education, housing, and healthcare.
Maybe learn a iota about the economy before you start gargling Andrew Yang’s ballsack…
Like I said before, amazing how people will argue against their better interests. Really bold of you to assume I’m just lazy, too.
It’s really funny that you got this bent out of shape when someone just asks “why not both”
Ah well can’t help everyone, especially when they won’t bother trying, right?
Lol, arguing something will not work because it disregards very simple economic principles is not “arguing against my own interests”.
I mean, you’re obviously too lazy to apply yourself to learn basic concepts…so yeah, lazy asshole.
My dude, dunking on lazy idiots online is fun…
The irony… Coming from the idiot who thinks we could provide housing, medical care, education, food and give everyone $500 a month by just by changing taxes…
Considering how the government spends money on so much other shit, it would cost a pittance in comparison, and generate more flow in the economy.
I’m not last, I’m just gonna take advice from someone who probably stabs homeless people.
Again… You have no idea what you are talking about, and have no clue how much healthcare cost.
The federal government’s largest expense is social security (22%), Medicare (14%), and Medicaid(10%). That’s nearly half of the entire federal budget to cover some of the cost of living and healthcare for a minority of the country.
Granted our system is wasteful and inefficient, but not to the point where we wouldn’t have to vastly increase revenue to cover the entire populations healthcare, food, housing and education. We would have to reshape the entire economy to do so, and I think there is a moral imperative to do so. However, once that is accomplished, I do not see a reason to implement UBI, a plan that would just further increase the need for revenue that’s already being spent for better purposes.
I already explained why UBI would not stimulate the economy under a the economic conditions we were discussing. There’s a reason no communist country has implemented a UBI. You are just too dense to actually understand anything we’re talking about. You don’t even understand the reason UBI is a scam in our current economic system let alone a hypothetical one.
Lol, I advocate for universal housing, education, nutrition, and healthcare… But because you don’t understand basic economics, it means I want to murder homeless people?
Also I imagine you meant to say "I’m not lazy, I’m just not gonna take advice…?
It’s almost like you’re too lazy to even read your own responses…
Ah, I see where the problem lies.
You were so wrapped up in the current situation that your very limited imagination couldn’t comprehend changing it, and you’re myopically focused on the world as it is instead of what it could be. I can understand someone who isn’t very creative having a hard time thinking outside of what’s put in front of them, so I’m sorry I was trying to introduce a hypothetical that was so over your head that you clearly got frustrated with the situation.
You were clearly thinking from a “how could we work this ass things are” situation because of your mental limitations, and I was casually thinking of hypotheticals and being goal first oriented, thinking of the optional situation and willing to work backwards.
So yes, of course my cavalier suggestion wouldn’t work in the economic system we have now, and since you’re not really able to look outside of that, you, like a frustrated child, see it as an impossibility and lashed out.
I think it would certainly be a noble goal and something to work towards, humanity having it’s basic needs met with a small stipend on top of that, and what a pity there’s people who would fight tooth and nail against such an idealized situation.
I suppose you’re very much wrapped up in the puritanical thought of life without work is sinful and should be avoided, especially with your repeated accusations of laziness directed at me, so such a future would be a nightmare for you. I only assume you never plan on retirement and view retired people with contempt for their lack of toil. It’s why I assume you wish to stab homeless people, for their sloth. You say you’re for nationalized education, housing, good and healthcare but honestly I don’t think your heart is in it if one of your big arguments against ubi is the same one being used against all those things, the horrible idea that some people might not work when they could.
Ah well, have fun working towards humanity having to do perpetual labor forever, I’m sure that’s a great idea. Wouldn’t want too many idle hands and all.