• dejected_warp_core@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    edit-2
    5 days ago

    This was my experience too, until I learned a few things.

    • If you’re coming from another programming language, the equivalent capabilities you’re probably used to are Box, dyn, and Rc.
    • Dynamic dispatch (dyn) isn’t really necessary a lot of the time. Identify where you absolutely need it and solve everything else through other means.
    • You wind up with lifetime specifier problems if you try to do a lot with references (&). Instead, try to re-think your structs and functions using composition and clone/copy instead. It’s less efficient, but it’s easier to optimize a running program, too.
    • Rust enum, match, if let, and ? are weird, but are where you get the most leverage in the language. Try to master them.
    • derive[...] is a first-class feature with a lot of standard lib support. Always use this to make your custom types mesh with the standard lib more seamlessly.
    • If you are experienced with the “Design Patterns” book, you absolutely need this: https://rust-unofficial.github.io/patterns/intro.html
    • Macros are an advanced feature, but help get you around limitations in generics and the type system in general. it really is worth knowing, and like the preprocessor in C/C++, isn’t avoidable at the intermediate level.
    • The compiler digs deep into your code to figure out types where they’re not explicitly declared. I’ve seen it reach into the return type, call-spec, and function calls within that function, to figure out types for things. This is very hard to observe without an IDE that’s checking syntax on the fly. Lean into both of those for more readable and maintainable code.
    • if and match are expressions, not statements! You can use either block to evaluate to a single value, useful in composite expressions like let. Example; let x=if y>20 { y } else { 0 }; Or use them to return values from functions (w/o need of a return statement).
  • kubica@fedia.io
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    16 days ago

    The weird part of rust is replacing straight forward semicolons from other languages with the more verbose .unwrap();.

    Just kidding, don’t lecture me about it.

    • marcos@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      16 days ago

      The amount of people on the internet seriously complaining that both Rust error handling sucks and that .unwrap(); is too verbose is just staggering.

      • dejected_warp_core@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        6 days ago

        I will say this: for me, learning rust was 80% un-learning habits from other languages.

        People tend to not like it when they have to change habits, especially if those took a long (and painful) time to acquire.

        In this particular case, this is the same complaint Go faced with its form of explicit error handling. And Java, for that matter.

        Honestly, Rust does a killer job of avoiding checked exceptions and verbose error hooks by way of the ? operator, and requiring all possible match branches to be accounted for. If you embrace errors fully, by using Result<> and custom Error types, your program gets a massive boost in robustness for not a lot of fuss. I recently learned that it gets even better if you embrace enum as a way to define error values, and make sure it implements useful traits like From and Display. With that, error handling code gets a lot more succinct, permitting one to more easily sift through different error values after a call (should you need to). All of that capability far exceeds any perception of clunkyness, IMO.

  • Kamikaze Rusher@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    15 days ago

    This is my experience every time I return to learning rust. I’m guessing that if I used it more often than once a quarter with hobby projects I’d stop falling into the same traps.

  • mholiv@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    0
    ·
    16 days ago

    Skill Issue.

    For reals though adopting a functional style of programming makes rust extremely pleasant . It’s only when people program in object oriented styles that this gets annoying.

    No loops, and no state change make rust devs happy devs.

    • AnarchoEngineer@lemmy.dbzer0.com
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      ·
      15 days ago

      I just started learning rust like two days ago and I haven’t had too many issues with OOP so far… is it going to get considerably worse as the complexity of my projects increases?

      • Ephera@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        15 days ago

        The thing with OOP, particularly how it’s used in GCed languages, is that it’s all about handing references out to wherever and then dealing with the complexity of not knowing who has access to your fields via getters & setters, or by cloning memory whenever it’s modified in asynchronous code.

        Rust has quite the opposite mindset. It’s all about tracking where references go. It pushes your code to be very tree-shaped, i.e. references typically¹ only exist between a function and the functions it calls underneath. This is what allows asynchronous code to be safe in Rust, and I would also argue that the tree shape makes code easier to understand, too.

        But yeah, some of the patterns you might know from OOP will not work in Rust for that reason. You will likely need to get into a different mindset over time.

        Also just in case: We are talking OOP in the sense of the paradigm, i.e. object-oriented.
        Just using objects, i.e. data with associated functions/methods, that works completely normal in Rust.

        ¹) If you genuinely need references that reach outside the tree shape, which is mostly going to be the case, if you work with multiple threads, then you can do so by wrapping your data structures in Arc<Mutex<_>> or similar. But yeah, when learning, you should try to solve your problems without these. Most programs don’t need them.

        • dejected_warp_core@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          5 days ago

          It pushes your code to be very tree-shaped

          This is basically where my learning took me. I had to develop this notion that there was a preferred directionality to ownership and data flow, like “grain” in a piece of wood. Everything is easier if you go with the grain. “Tree-shaped” works too, since it basically is the call graph of a (single threaded) program.

          The point where I realized all this was when I tried to do a very Python/JS-brained thing: return a closure from a function. The moment you try to “curry” values into the closure, you have to “move” them to solve for ownership, lest you bring timelines into the picture. Which isn’t always what you want in a generic and reusable function. And sure enough, the standard lib and other popular libraries want you to pass a closure to functions instead.

          • Ephera@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            0
            ·
            14 days ago

            Hmm, not sure, if I’ve heard of it. I’m guessing, we’re not talking about simply drawing a UML class diagram…? Is it for figuring out which object will have to clean up which other objects, in non-GCed languages?

              • Ephera@lemmy.ml
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                0
                ·
                12 days ago

                Ah, interesting. I went from garbage-collected languages where thinking about ownership might be useful for keeping complexity low and occasionally comes up when you manage lists of objects, but ultimately isn’t needed, to Rust where well-defined ownership is enforced by the language.

                So, I wasn’t aware that ownership is even as concrete of a thing in other languages…

                • bestboyfriendintheworld@sh.itjust.works
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  0
                  ·
                  11 days ago

                  Oh you need this in garbage collected languages too, once you run into memory use issues. GC languages are notorious for being wasteful with memory, even when working correctly.