A lot of vegans are communists too. We want human exploitation to end just as much as animal exploitation. You will normally hear that rhetoric from liberal vegan “humans are the disease” ecofascist types. Granted, you cannot live under capitalism without human exploitation. I cannot eat most if not all foods without what I consider to be effectively slavery. It drives me mad.
No human is ever treated the way animals are though. And they made the society that they’re suffering from.
And humans can communicate and know what is going on.
I think you need to look into how rare earth minerals are mined. Or how slavery works. Humans treat humans as bad as any animal if they can make a profit.
Consider that humans sometimes bully other humans to death simply for the power trip. That is some pretty horrific physiological torture.
We’re not that far from accepted child labor. Chimney sweeps. Heck there’s a chance clothes we’ve worn this week were sewn by children in a sweatshop. Or the phone or computer metals were mined with child slave labor.
This is why veganism is hard for me, it’s absolutely not possible to live a cruelty free life unless you’re living on your own land with your own spun clothes and never consuming medication (all tested on lab mice).
Drawing the “perfect line” at eating only plant based food is fine, but it’s a far cry from a cruelty free life. Folks get very serious optimizing on one dimension of cruelty (foods not being animal products) but then completely ignore everything else. And then bully others who do not do the same.
I’d rather see a universe like the OP, better to celebrate every step folks do take in the right direction, not tell them it’s not enough. Everyone should be celebrated for:
making clothes last longer
buying used clothes
keeping the same vehicle longer
choosing vegan dishes when they can
delaying PC and phone upgrades, buying used when they do
taking the bus over driving, walking instead of taking the bus
You’ve put my feelings about these sort of hyper focused movements into words very well.
There is so fucking much wrong with the world, and we should be celebrating steps in the right direction rather than playing crab bucket about what’s good enough.
The overwhelming majority of the issues in the world didn’t get this bad overnight, and expecting things to just jump straight to the end state is just silly. Especially when there are forces out there devoted to maintaining the status quo.
That, plus the overall attitude I see so often of “the only possible reason things could be this bad is because everyone else but me is stupid” drives me up a wall. That one I can chalk up to youth at least.
But also a lot of vegans: “I am against abuse, but only if it is against animals. I don’t care about humans”
A lot of vegans are communists too. We want human exploitation to end just as much as animal exploitation. You will normally hear that rhetoric from liberal vegan “humans are the disease” ecofascist types. Granted, you cannot live under capitalism without human exploitation. I cannot eat most if not all foods without what I consider to be effectively slavery. It drives me mad.
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Yeah, it’s a problem.
No human is ever treated the way animals are though. And they made the society that they’re suffering from. And humans can communicate and know what is going on.
I think you need to look into how rare earth minerals are mined. Or how slavery works. Humans treat humans as bad as any animal if they can make a profit.
Consider that humans sometimes bully other humans to death simply for the power trip. That is some pretty horrific physiological torture.
We’re not that far from accepted child labor. Chimney sweeps. Heck there’s a chance clothes we’ve worn this week were sewn by children in a sweatshop. Or the phone or computer metals were mined with child slave labor.
This is why veganism is hard for me, it’s absolutely not possible to live a cruelty free life unless you’re living on your own land with your own spun clothes and never consuming medication (all tested on lab mice).
Drawing the “perfect line” at eating only plant based food is fine, but it’s a far cry from a cruelty free life. Folks get very serious optimizing on one dimension of cruelty (foods not being animal products) but then completely ignore everything else. And then bully others who do not do the same.
I’d rather see a universe like the OP, better to celebrate every step folks do take in the right direction, not tell them it’s not enough. Everyone should be celebrated for:
You’ve put my feelings about these sort of hyper focused movements into words very well.
There is so fucking much wrong with the world, and we should be celebrating steps in the right direction rather than playing crab bucket about what’s good enough.
The overwhelming majority of the issues in the world didn’t get this bad overnight, and expecting things to just jump straight to the end state is just silly. Especially when there are forces out there devoted to maintaining the status quo.
That, plus the overall attitude I see so often of “the only possible reason things could be this bad is because everyone else but me is stupid” drives me up a wall. That one I can chalk up to youth at least.
Do what you can, when you can. I’m not perfect by any means, but I am continually pushing myself to do better.
This is the perfect comment! Thank you for putting it so eloquently!