Genocide should be reserved for actual attempts to remove certain genetic lines from the gene pool, which includes going after the diaspora, the way the Nazis did with Jews in WW2.
So what was the real death toll for the Nazi Jewish genocide? Because while some Jewish groups have distinct genetic lines, many don’t. And Jewish people who were simply ethnic Germans also got sent to the camps. Do they not get counted as part of the Holocaust, as they were only targeted for their religion, not their genetics?
In practice, because human beings tend to marry and have kids at much higher rates within their religious and cultural groups than without, a genocide against a religious group is indistinguishable from a genocide against a genetic lineage. Also, your definition allows for a lot of genocide apologia. Those who want to downplay a genocide can simply say that an ethnic group was merely targeted for some action among that ethnic group. “They weren’t killed for their race. We just made it a capital offense to listen to the music most commonly listened to by members of that race. They were killed for their musical taste, not their race. So it’s not a genocide.”
If someone rounded you, your family and all your extended family up and put you in captivity. Sterilized you but otherwise took care of everyone feeding and even providing them medical access when needed. Even without murdering a single person that’s genocide.
Cultural genocide which is just as serious. Is something that the Chinese government is heavily invested in with their one China policy. Purposely targeting any group with the goal of its elimination whether it’s the Jews the Muslims the First Nations peoples, the blacks the Indians, Israel’s genocide of Palestinians that has been going for more than a half a century. It doesn’t matter how large the group is if you target them or their cultures with the intent of eliminating them that is genocide. Murder is not required.
There is unfortunately a lot of overlap. When it comes to genocide, groups tend to be rather large. Even a bit of a mass. And most don’t have the time, patience or resources to terminate them without murder. So it is understandable.
When it comes to Trump and American conservatives. They are genocidal. If you’re a Democrat they want to target and eliminate you. Even if they don’t murder you. Gay? They want you gone. Trans? Ditto. Black? Ahyup. Muslim? You betcha. Jew that isn’t financing or enabling them? Get to safety.
What trump is doing in Iran might technically not be genocide, yet. But we do have some good words for it. War crimes.
Shunting or excluding is a fairly sanitizing term. If you want to exclude/eliminate people from a society they depend on to survive. Simply based on who they are. Even if you ignorantly never think about that or the logistics of it. Just wanting them gone. It’s effectively genocide all the same.
Bigotry is having prejudiced thoughts against a group as an individual. Genocide is when you act on those thoughts as a society.
It’s broad. But not to the point of meaninglessness. To the point of inclusiveness. And that’s meaningful.
I’m definitely coming at this from a more Anarchist/libertarian mindset so others not quite understanding is completely understandable. But ask yourself this. How did all the things we commonly accept as genocides, Nazi Germany’s treatment of the Jews, Israel’s treatment of Palestinians. How did it start?
What made them genocides. Was it the speed, was it the brutality? Or was it simply that these groups were targeted to be excluded and eliminated from society? How slowly must one strangle a culture or group for it to be acceptable? Germany did theirs in only a few years. Israel has been at theirs for decades. So does that make Israel’s acceptable? Because they’re going slower with it overall. Granted they’ve greatly increased their Pace in the last couple years. But the genocide didn’t even start in this last decade. It was always a genocide.
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So what was the real death toll for the Nazi Jewish genocide? Because while some Jewish groups have distinct genetic lines, many don’t. And Jewish people who were simply ethnic Germans also got sent to the camps. Do they not get counted as part of the Holocaust, as they were only targeted for their religion, not their genetics?
In practice, because human beings tend to marry and have kids at much higher rates within their religious and cultural groups than without, a genocide against a religious group is indistinguishable from a genocide against a genetic lineage. Also, your definition allows for a lot of genocide apologia. Those who want to downplay a genocide can simply say that an ethnic group was merely targeted for some action among that ethnic group. “They weren’t killed for their race. We just made it a capital offense to listen to the music most commonly listened to by members of that race. They were killed for their musical taste, not their race. So it’s not a genocide.”
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If someone rounded you, your family and all your extended family up and put you in captivity. Sterilized you but otherwise took care of everyone feeding and even providing them medical access when needed. Even without murdering a single person that’s genocide.
Cultural genocide which is just as serious. Is something that the Chinese government is heavily invested in with their one China policy. Purposely targeting any group with the goal of its elimination whether it’s the Jews the Muslims the First Nations peoples, the blacks the Indians, Israel’s genocide of Palestinians that has been going for more than a half a century. It doesn’t matter how large the group is if you target them or their cultures with the intent of eliminating them that is genocide. Murder is not required.
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There is unfortunately a lot of overlap. When it comes to genocide, groups tend to be rather large. Even a bit of a mass. And most don’t have the time, patience or resources to terminate them without murder. So it is understandable.
When it comes to Trump and American conservatives. They are genocidal. If you’re a Democrat they want to target and eliminate you. Even if they don’t murder you. Gay? They want you gone. Trans? Ditto. Black? Ahyup. Muslim? You betcha. Jew that isn’t financing or enabling them? Get to safety.
What trump is doing in Iran might technically not be genocide, yet. But we do have some good words for it. War crimes.
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Shunting or excluding is a fairly sanitizing term. If you want to exclude/eliminate people from a society they depend on to survive. Simply based on who they are. Even if you ignorantly never think about that or the logistics of it. Just wanting them gone. It’s effectively genocide all the same.
Bigotry is having prejudiced thoughts against a group as an individual. Genocide is when you act on those thoughts as a society.
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It’s broad. But not to the point of meaninglessness. To the point of inclusiveness. And that’s meaningful.
I’m definitely coming at this from a more Anarchist/libertarian mindset so others not quite understanding is completely understandable. But ask yourself this. How did all the things we commonly accept as genocides, Nazi Germany’s treatment of the Jews, Israel’s treatment of Palestinians. How did it start?
What made them genocides. Was it the speed, was it the brutality? Or was it simply that these groups were targeted to be excluded and eliminated from society? How slowly must one strangle a culture or group for it to be acceptable? Germany did theirs in only a few years. Israel has been at theirs for decades. So does that make Israel’s acceptable? Because they’re going slower with it overall. Granted they’ve greatly increased their Pace in the last couple years. But the genocide didn’t even start in this last decade. It was always a genocide.
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