I have heard rumors of sexual assault allegations not being taken seriously in the PSL, but I have also seen another person saying they were just a wrecker …
I also heard that the structure is not really democratic.
I really do want to know what is really going on with the party.
Sources (that I have read and that also happen to relate to the topics above): Deleted them cuz they might have included names
My personal read of it is that PSL has problems but it’s also good enough that it’s not easy to discard and this is not compatible with people who want to slot every org and faction into a clean box of good or evil, so people end up pretzeling narrative in one direction or another, either to present PSL as squeaky clean or as absolute trash.
Astute, concise observation. I concur.
What is the state of communist parties in Amerika anyway? Seeing DSA called one despite it aligning with democrats and zionism. The nazbol parties which requires no explanation. So the only real communist party I know of is PSL which has a lot of SA accusations (I have no experience with the party it as I do not live in Amerika).
PSL is the one party I recommend when talking to Amerikans because it’s the only one I know of thanks to this community. So I can’t help but feel worried that I am doing something wrong because of these allegations.
The solidarity groups is something I’ll recommend after seeing that recommended in this thread at least.
Might be biased sincs I finished a podcast miniseries about this, but the US left at this moment is very reminiscent of 1917-23 “social democratic” currents in Weimar Germany. It’s all very discordant with an internally dominant right flank being the largest party, and some left flank parties being both smaller and not the best strategically. Except I don’t think the parties had SA allegations 😭
I think it’s a fair perspective. Also, back then, patriarchy was stronger and more widespread, we didn’t have internet and satellite communications, and people had more to lose by speaking of SA experiences, regardless of gender or orientation. So a lack of allegations doesn’t necessarily imply a lack of SAs.
The reaction from members cemented to me that the PSL isn’t a serious socialist group, but I really don’t know of any alternatives in the US. I did used to think they were the best option available for people in the great satan but now I wouldn’t recommend them to anyone, especially women.
Some serious communists need to start something, but I don’t imagine they can safely be a public group.
I don’t think Statesians should be worrying over what’s the best most revolutionary org in the us. None of the big names in the us have any real motion. If a nationwide organization in the us isn’t centered directly in indigenous and black liberation, then it’s not an org with any serious revolutionary potential. By that I don’t mean having a good party line or a good reading list, I mean that the org itself needs to be a manifestation of the struggle for indigenous and black liberation. The PSL, FRSO, or DSA are not that. As I understand it, the PSL is a group of about 2,000 people who do protests and no mutual aid. I have heard that they have good educational material though, which is cool. The BPP and AIM were the most successful groups in the us and the PSL is nothing like either.
I very much still think people should join orgs in order to connect with comrades, get training, and build up the organizational capacity of their communities. Join FRSO, DSA, even your local Food not Bombs, book clubs, or volunteer groups. Before I would’ve recommended PSL too. But if I had the opportunity to recommend someone in the us to join an org, it wouldn’t be the PSL now, especially, just like you said, if they were a woman. The reason isn’t because they’re not the perfect org, it’s specifically because the PSL is not a safe organizing space for fem presenting people. The org has covered up multiple cases of sexual abuse. I’m not judging the PSL for having to deal with sexual abuse, I’m judging them for how they’ve handled it.
I’d argue that these groups are necessary, if not to be the revolutionary vanguard, but to help the revolutionary vanguard. Also serve as necessary training grounds to the unpracticed.
The idea that nobody should put effort into a group because its not the vanguard when one doesn’t exist isn’t the best, in my opinion. (You did not say this, I should note clearly for anyone reading. You critique the focus on “big orgs” from marxists before supporting the participation in them. I only want to add to this line.)
BPP was part of a rainbow coalition and Fred Hampton really pushed for uniting all workers. Huey P. Newton also advocated for white people to start a “white panther party” to support the black panther party. If we are to help ensure the future of socialism, and the success of the vanguard party, it is critical that we organize now, and gain the experience of practice and further our studies with other comrades and other oppressed peoples. This building of power and class consciousness among the most oppressed people will help bring about the support necessary to meet the conditions of revolution. Should a moment arise in which you can’t justify being with a party, or it acts against revolution. One can simply focus their efforts on another organization.
Do not focus on a perfection, we most focus on agitating the people at the sharpest contradictions of the working class. We also, because of the time in which western marxists find themselves in a state of profound nihilism towards revolution(something I would say is a liberal tendency), must encourage our comrades to fight.
We act as though the capitalist state only grows in strength. Yet if one were to apply historical dialectics one will find that the contradictions only sharpen. The people grow only more oppressed. And the solution to the struggles of the working class grows even more obvious to even the uninitiated worker.
Without this “revolutionary optimism”, there is no chance for a revolution. Even with the perfect conditions.
Well said.
Thank you for the reply. I appreciate it greatly.
Every now and then a new post surfaces, saying the PSL is bad. This is quite suspicious to me, as they seem one of the most organized leftist parties in the US. If not the PSL, who then?
I did not say that it was bad, just wondering what was going on with it.
Create one?
I think there are some solid sources here: https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Party_for_Socialism_and_Liberation
I think they’re kind of bad, but their competition is all worse on at least one point, so they may be the best of a bad lot.
It doesn’t really matter what party someone joins in the U$, as long as they get experience, make connections, and don’t drink the koolaid.
Every party in the U$ is happily registered with the state and happy to stay in their good graces as long as they can collect more dues.
TIL ProleWiki is back.
Yeah, it seems like there are no communist parties I would consider decent if we are looking at them from the perspective of the likelihood that they will become a vanguard in the future.
If you can’t find any good communist parties that suit what you are looking for, you can always join the solidarity organizations! Those are in dire need of people.
What are those? :0
Solidarity orgs are basically organizations that work to humanize the oppressed. One simple example are the Cuban Solidarity orgs in the heart of the Gusano capital(Miami).
This is a small rally they did in Miami in October -> https://www.cubainformacion.tv/images/stories/2026/10/VID_20261028_WA0180.mp4
They act very similarly to the Pro Palestinian orgs that work tirelessly to humanize the Palestinian people and to denounce the Zionists. Working in a solidarity org is a very enjoyable experience.
join a group and pull it left. Its going to be far more effective than doing it alone. You’ll find tons of other marxists involved in these groups who also are trying to pull it left.
I have no money to pay for the dues, though.
I don’t either, many still let yo join
Which organizations let you join?
I’ve been a part of DSA, several liberal organizations, and local ones, and PSL. There are options, the focus on financial contribution being the primary mode of helping an org is due to a lack of imagination I think. Labor contributions are immensely valuable for every organization.
If you truly cant organize with any group at all and have exhausted all options, (which you also wont need to do for this step) simply take on the task of organizing in your local community. No matter how small or how big the community is. If you’re in a town of 40,000 then 30 people is already a fairly decent influence. In my personal organizing efforts I’ve made groups that broke 50 twice.
You take the theory you have and you apply it in practice, start with people you trust, then people they trust, and so on. Even if your group doesn’t grow extremely large or burn down capitalism in your specific area its invaluable practice.
The issue with living in the middle of the suburbs is that there is nothing around and the peeps are probably petty-bourgeoisie or labor aristocrats. ;-;
Also social anxiety hurts.
PSL doesn’t, though.
Removed by mod
As stated in another thread, that post has a lot of full names, with no regard for doxxing comrades.
This is a public space that we should assume is getting watched by kiwifarms and other reactionary forums, and so should be extremely wary of doxxing.
Being critical or making critiques of PSL or other communist parties is fine, posting internal party drama that doxxes people is not.
Calling the botched coverup of sexual assault “internal party drama” while collaborating in that coverup is a new low even by incelgrad standards.
Ok, let me try again without the profanity and insults, to see if “Rule 3” was really the problem with my previous comment.
Kiwifarms (and other reactionary spaces) have the same access to substack that we do. That article is already on the radar of reactionaries, so posting it here isn’t going to dox people any more than they’re already doxxed.
I don’t believe that fears of "doxxing* people (most to all of whom are fairly public figures) is a good enough reason to remove all mention of this particular article. Especially since it’s still easy to find a link to it in the modlog.
If the threat of doxxing from that information is as credible as you say it is, then you should purge the comment entirely. I will refrain from sharing any of the substack articles in the future, here or anywhere else.
It’s clearly disengenuous as hell. You should genuinely spread that article as much as you can, it’s not doxxing to simply name public figures. Every single person mentioned by full name in that article is a public figure who’s already and intentionally been widely popularized as speakers on behalf of the PSL. It simply is not doxxing, that’s just a lie, and the motivation is not for their personal safety. The only motivation for actually removing those posts and not engaging with anyone who calls out the fact that it’s not doxxing is that it’s really about protecting the only potential party apparatus in the US, which I absolutely can not blame a person for and I literally hid my trauma because I wanted to hide it from others; but it’s so much more important that these things are struggled and fought on head on so that either the PSL can advance and evolve out of needing to address this or a new party can form which is able to understand the critical importance of these issues.
The substack is already public I don’t get what the problem is tbh
misogyny same as always
Holy shit they temp banned CutieBootieTootie after she pointed out how everybody who was “doxxed” is already a public figure complete with sources.
incelgrad strikes again
Neither do I, but I’m uncomfortable challenging him on that point.
After looking up mod actions on this I get it
Done, it’s purged.
You can still see it in the modlog, probably should consider removing the comment entirely then.
Good call, I’ll do that now.
Removed by mod
Woah what just happened?
“the structure is not really democratic” I see little wrong with this tbh
The issue with this is that the party members cannot select people that will represent them, so they could get leaders that are detached from not only the party members, but the working class as a whole.
I must ask why you do not see a problem with a lack of democratic structure in an organization like the one mentioned above.
All leadership within the party is democratically elected by membership.
I just don’t believe in representative democracies without widespread direct democratic participation by the masses like in the USSR or modern China.
You are comparing entire countries to an organization with (maybe) a few thousand members; yes, the leadership of a country would not be representative of the masses if only a few people elected them, but this is not the same for a party.
The point of having a democratic structure for a party is to allow for election of leaders that can be held accountable and having a meaningful influence in the party’s actions, rather than be a cult for some pseudo-communists or some other.
Your alternative is what exactly? Have the leaders be appointed, rather than having the party members vote for their leader? Try to get the settler-colonial population of America to vote on who gets to lead the PSL (if your concern is about mass democratic participation)? There is no good option except to have a democratic election process for higher offices in the party if you want a leadership be accountable to the party’s members.
I’m quite unsure how you got appointment out of what I said, I just believe that the masses’ political participation shouldn’t be limited to just representation as “democracy” is frequently defined as in the West.
