Hello!

I’ve seen a few posts praising the US and I can’t deny that I’ve also had a very concrete goal of moving permanently to the US eventually. I’m from the EU so the “reality” that I have of the US comes mainly from the media. With this being said, I’d like the brutally honest opinions of those that experienced the US first-hand, whether you’re American, have always lived in the US and absolutely hate it, or if you moved from the EU to the US and are loving the experience.

  • As expats, I think we’re all running from something from our home country (work conditions, family situations, etc). What made you move to/out of the US?
  • Do you feel your QoL (quality of life) has improved with your move to/out of the US?
    • If so, would you attribute this to working conditions/salary? Or living conditions such as more free time, good pension/retirement, etc
  • Do you plan on going back to your home country? If so, what is the main driver of that decision?

Last, but not least, for those living in the US, do you believe that the pros of having more/better career opportunities (at least for skilled labor/PhD level) in the US outweigh the cons of living there, namely:

  • poor/expensive healthcare
  • extremely high tuition fees for colleges
  • high crime rates (naturally highly dependent on the place you live)
  • small amount of time for maternity leave (I don’t mind the small amount for paternity leave, but in Scandinavian countries mothers can have up to a year of maternity leave which I believe is very beneficial for the kids. I do value countries that value and protect the family structure)
  • … and a general low work-life balance? (This last bullet point is not as important to me as I do like and appreciate the hustle culture of the US which makes effort/skills be more appreciated and compensated)

Thank you all! Apologies in advance if this has been asked multiple times before, but I’d like to condensate different perspectives in a single thread if possible as it might be helpful for others as well! :)

  • Thor-Marvel@alien.topBEnglish
    1·
    1 year ago

    Your questions are so prejudiced, so I would suggest you adjust your mindset before even considering moving.

    You admitted that you have never lived in the US and the reality is all from the media. But you already assumed:

    • “poor/expensive healthcare” if you live in a big city. It definitely isn’t poor. And if you have a good job it definitely isn’t expensive, giving you seem to live in Norway where taxes are eye watering. Also, different from Norway, there are a lot more people in the US, if you are unfortunate enough to have a rare illness chances are higher than someone in the US will have more expensive than a Norwegian doctor.
    • “extremely high tuition”. It isn’t extremely high. The US college education system is messed up in its own way but to call everything extremely high is wrong. The sticker price isn’t at all real. On the top end, Ivy League colleges are all need blind. And there are many states state colleges that are fairly reasonable (eg university of California, CUNY, SUNY systems). Not to mention the earning potential is a lot higher in the US. The average graduate has more student debt in the UK than in the US, despite colleges being “cheaper” in the UK.
    • “short maternity leave” just because the law doesn’t require maternity leave doesn’t mean mothers go back to work one week later. If you want Scandi style 1 or 2 years of leave, you won’t get it.
    • what is low work life balance? To me living in a tiny country where you can never advance your career, being taxed to the tee, being prescribed one way of life, having to rely on the gov are all worse than working hard and making a shit ton of money and then spending it on things I want.

    It seems from your question that you haven’t a European hoity-toity attitude about the US, even if you didn’t mean to come across as snobbish. If you want a European way of life, don’t go, because it isn’t and will never be Europe. But if you do want to go, you need to change your mindset and accept a different way of living. Higher risk, high reward.

    • blackkettle@alien.topBEnglish
      1·
      1 year ago

      I’m from the US and I very much like my home, so this isn’t a “diss the US” comment, and I agree with most of your points but tuition is indeed absurd compared to the majority of EU countries.

      I live in Switzerland now and tuition here for ETHZ - top 10 worldwide ranked university is about $1500-$1800 per year. I did. my undergrad in the US through the UC system which is indeed super reasonable for in state residents but even in the early 2000s it was around $11k/year not counting all the overpriced textbooks. It’s not even close.

      Assuming he is smart enough and works hard enough to qualify through the gymnasium system here, my kid will have the right to attend ETHZ or any of the other federal/local Unis at that same price point. And it doesn’t depend on the subjective charity evaluation of a third party entity.

      I love the US and where I grew up and one day I might find myself back there, it had a lot of great features but this point is not one of them.

      • Bird_Gazer@alien.topBEnglish
        1·
        1 year ago

        Just an aside—my daughter did her undergrad in the CSU system, and her grant money covered tuition, books, and gas for commuting. She lived at home.

        It can be done here with little to no money or debt.

        • OllieOllieOxenfry@alien.topBEnglish
          1·
          1 year ago

          Anecdotally it’s possible to have a low cost college experience in the U.S. but from a data perspective it’s quantifiably more expensive here, extraordinarily so.

    • OllieOllieOxenfry@alien.topBEnglish
      1·
      1 year ago

      “extremely high tuition”. It isn’t extremely high. The US college education system is messed up in its own way but to call everything extremely high is wrong. The sticker price isn’t at all real. On the top end, Ivy League colleges are all need blind. And there are many states state colleges that are fairly reasonable (eg university of California, CUNY, SUNY systems). Not to mention the earning potential is a lot higher in the US. The average graduate has more student debt in the UK than in the US, despite colleges being “cheaper” in the UK.

      “short maternity leave” just because the law doesn’t require maternity leave doesn’t mean mothers go back to work one week later. If you want Scandi style 1 or 2 years of leave, you won’t get it.

      These two things are facts though. College is expensive, and our maternity leave is short. Period. It’s not an opinion. It’s data.

      • Thor-Marvel@alien.topBEnglish
        1·
        1 year ago

        That is true but what I said is also true. Ivy is need blind, basically free if you can’t afford it. Many mothers have 6-12 months of mat leave if you have a good job. Not all, but many do.

        My point being, in the US things can get extremely bad as well as extremely good. In Europe everything is run of the mill. So don’t move from Europe to the US if you aren’t prepared for low lows but high highs.

    • Dad_Feels@alien.topBEnglish
      1·
      1 year ago

      If you have a rare illness than it’s more likely that someone will know how to treat it in the US - sure, tell that to my partner that almost died and was medically induced into a coma after three separate visits to the ER sent him home because they had no idea what effects jardiance could have - told him his A1C was fine and sent him on his way when he was slurring words and could barely stand. They made me leave when I tried to advocate for him.

      Tell that to my mother who died in her 40’s because they wouldn’t send an ambulance without her health insurance information (which, how could a kid calling 911 know this information?)

      American healthcare is disgusting and sick and predatory. It’s the reason I couldn’t have the childhood my mother wanted for me. It’s the reason so many people are bankrupt. It’s going to be the death of all of us because they care more about lobby relationships to hawk medication that doctors aren’t even well-versed on. It’s deplorable.