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I was actually a big organizer in my community last year and had to step away because my wife and I were getting doxxed from MAGA idiots, but I agree with the first comment.
At least in my city, no planning other then planning the next protest is all they do. People ask to help and really they just want to help very little so they feel useful. Which usually is “I can buy more poster boards next time for others” and “I’ll help set up the sign up sheets for next protest.”
I tried organizing strikes but people wouldn’t show up if it wasn’t convenient for them. Most people want it to go back to how it was, few want it to completely change. I’m going to partake in the national strike, but fuck the No Kings protest. It’s become a festival for those wanting to not be unconvinced with real civil disobedience.
- People every time a post about protests is made: “This will accomplish nothing.”
- Those same people when asked what they’re personally doing since they talk like they know what will and won’t work: “Also nothing.”
- (Bonus points for the ones who say violent uprisings are needed, but are not violently rising up themselves. Double bonus for “well I don’t live in the US.”)
Protests aren’t the solution on their own, they’re a step in the process of people getting to the point of doing something about the situation they’ve found themselves in. You can’t fix a problem if you don’t first acknowledge and accept that it’s a problem. Stop crapping on people for protesting. Instead, encourage them to use that energy to take things further. And if you know so much about what will actually work and are going out of your way to tell people what they’re doing isn’t going to work, maybe you should be doing the thing you claim will work so you can lead by example instead of armchair directing.
A term I’ve been using is ‘activation’. people who are in the early stages of activation attend protests - more often attendance is more activation. This eventually evolves into active participation in support networks, vigilante counteraction, or legal resistance like journalism and similar activities.
Protest attendance is the start of most individuals’ activation, and we can’t knock that starting place if we want greater numbers participating in the counteraction apparatus going forward.
Yeh the other step is actual violence. Not condoning or promoting it.
Just saying that has to be the next follow up if they’re not listening to he protests.
I thought a general strike was in the works for May 1st?
One-day strikes are the same as one-day protests. Good visibility and networking but no actual pressure on their own. Ideally a general atrike would be “indefinite until our demands are met” but the US doesn’t have enough class unity or social safety net for that right now.
And it’s no kings.
Remember, if your organization is big enough to organize a general strike, the feds are there and watching. Watch your back
recall that the FBI infiltrated the civil rights movement and more even before we had a police state empowered by the Patriot Act surveillance and AI data collection.
I have zero proof, but I suspect that they are actively disrupting all attempts at organization. This is based on the history of CIA and FBI; we never know what they are doing currently, we only know a tiny bit of what they have done in the past.
Maybe I’m paranoid.
No you’re not paranoid. However, the point of surveillance is not to repress, but to make us afraid to act (panopticon and stuff). Not everything could be done through organization; but not system shift could be done without. A strong solidarity network is something that could people to act by other mean, help them to get inform on industries by people being exploited by those industries. And of course building international solidarity.
Depending of your country or your affinities, you could even join an union under a pseudonyme
Paranoid has proven to be downright reasonable
What was that one phrase again? Something like “there are two kinds of conspiracy theories: antisemitic woo and declassified CIA documents”
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One of the organizers of Standing Rock was framed and turned in by their partner of like 3± years, iirc. The fbi offered them ~$2000 and so they planted a gun in their partners belongings before a camp raid.
Remember kids, anyone can become a tool of the state if put in the right position
Could be a person not living in the USA, Max.
Us foreigners also have opinions on what’s happening in the US, because it affects us too, but we have no way to affect change in the US, other than our boycotts.
IDK Russia did a good job swaying the US public opinion and spreading propaganda.
I was gonna say I bet a lot of the accounts complaining about these protests are Russian bots
you guys simply cannot take criticism can you
American exceptionalism. They are the best country ever! Therefore, the way they are doing things is the best way it could possibly done, nothing could possibly be done differently, and anyone saying anything to the contrary must be foreign agents trying to undermine the best country ever!
Note that the person criticising the original is also not active in organising a general strike. It is permissable to hold opinions without being obliged to act on them.
Yes. But the moment you release your opinion out on the wild, we’re allowed to ridicule you for them.
Of course you can. I’m just saying that the criticism is stupid in this case. I mean, I think that fusion power would be a good thing, but fuck me for not working 24 hours a day on a PhD in nuclear physics.
But that’s more like having people talk about how we should do nuclear and renewable power, and you coming along complaining people should be working on developing fusion power instead because fission power just won’t do anything
Not it isn’t.
Arguing that fission power won’t do anything is objectively incorrect.
Arguing that a general strike would be more effective than weekend rallies alone is objectively correct.
Your analogy is not analagous.
Beyond that, arguing against doing something is not the same as arguing for doing something else, in addition to /or/ instead of the original something.
Arguing that fission power won’t do anything is objectively incorrect.
That’s an opinion, regardless of whether it’s true or not. The analogy is analogous because I’m taking the same actions and statements, applying them to analogous topics in a different field. Dismissing that because you believe your beliefs to be objective fact is just dishonest.
… Fission power works.
It generates energy.
This is objectively true.
That is not nothing.
If you were being hyperbolic, well then your analogy is not analagous because one end of it is hyperbolic.
Saying marches change nothing is hyperbolic as well.
Why should I listen to you? You’re not actively involved in organizing a general strike either.
You’ve opened this Pandora’s Box my friend there’s no closing it again now. It’s not being actively involved in organizing a general strike all the way down.
Yeah if you’re not actively involved in organizing a general strike you don’t get my vote. And since there are not any candidates meeting that criteria, I’m staying home on Election Day.
Don’t believe me? There’s 10 of millions of US citizens who will be doing the same thing!
Checkmate /s
This person could be French. They know how to bring the state to heel, and they share their experiences for those clearly in need of learning Americans. But they have to leave organizing to the people who are actually involved.
I don’t know why people have this illusion surrounding French people when they’re actively electing fascists and calling antifa a violent group of terrorists, while having their government give a minute of silence for the death of an actual nazi (like, actually posting on twitter that he loves Hitler -kind of nazi)
French people know nothing, they stopped understanding protests and revolts after Napoleon started shooting civilians with cannons and have been licking the boots of dictators since then. It’s no wonder that a bunch of them collaborated with the nazis back in ww2, and it’s no wonder they’re collaborating with the new nazis now.
The French people brought down three monarchies after Napoleon fired those cannons.
The No Kings Marches are just a prelude. Imagine all those millions of people participation in the upcoming general strike . Then imagine those millions turning to violence. Imagine them armed.
Just a suggestion, but becoming armed before becoming violent might be a better order of progression.
LOL what country do you think this is? “Becoming armed”? Bro this is America.
except the ones who have traditionally fought against the right to bear arms is the same people protesting. they need to be armed, and they need to protest with their arms, same reason a government will parade with their weapons
Bro this is America
yes, and my point still stands
You didn’t get the reference. I don’t think you picked up what I was putting down.
oh, the music video. that’s a whole ball of critique against the american system, and gun culture. but it still is what it is
Lol, good point, but I was speaking more in a general sense, not just this country.
That might be the more logical progression, but logic rarely comes into play in these things.
In fact, being armed before it’s time for violence is often a bad thing.
But when it is time, anything at hand can be a weapon.
Paris housewives once marched on Versailles and decapitated several guards with kitchen knives after they opened fire on the crowd.
you know, the americans are always going on about their 2A rights, but i don’t see them overthrowing tyranny when it’s present.
Your wallet is your strongest voice in the eyes of this administration. Think carefully about where you spend your hard earned money.
A single day of avoiding Walmart and Amazon is not meaningful if you give them your money tomorrow. Find local businesses that deserve your money and spend your money with them instead.
Buy less and buy better quality items that last longer. Reduce consumerism and give homemade gifts or experiences instead of more junk nobody needs. Use lending libraries, swap groups, and other methods to reduce your contribution to the economy, which is frankly the only thing the American government really is interested in.
And hats off to the person who successfully organizes a general strike. I’m cheering you on from Canada.
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Just because the poster doesn’t take action, doesn’t mean they are wrong.
Also how do you know they are not taking action? Maybe they are not posting updates for the feds to screw over any work they’ve done.
Sure, but do you see the hypocrisy in pointing one how little one form of resistance helps while participating in one that helps even less?
they are about equal levels of effective, tbh
No kings protests get media attention. How are your “nothing works” social media posts helping anything?
so what?
what kind of policy change did you accomplish last time with all that media attention?
take some criticism instead of straw manning.
what kind of policy change did you accomplish last time with all that media attention?
A number of substantive local policy changes as well as growing mutual aid networks as more people became aware of the movement. There is no magic wand to be waved here. It will take on the ground organizing in every city and getting that word out to grow the movement
What kind of policy change have you brought about by being a keyboard warrior?
Take some criticism instead of straw manning.
Physician heal thyself
What kind of policy change have you brought about
a full day’s reduction in our workweek over here.
enough about the strawman and deflection though, can you be specific about these local laws? what local policies have you improved with not one, but three earth shattering record breaking massive protests? what are the demands you are pushing for?
Wow, media attention! Perhaps they are gonna run a strongly worded letter on the dashreel at the bottom edge of the screen!
Newsflash: the media is in line, and in love, with the war.
You’re right. Better to be a keyboard warrior on a small reddit alternative.
Newsflash: No Kings isn’t about the war, but it’s interesting that the distraction is working on you.
Media attention is rarely a good thing
When you want public awareness of your movement it is.
Congratulations, everyone’s aware. Now what?
no kings has no leverage and no power and no stamina and no guts. are the police attacking them in the streets? i personaly see these kind of protests as controlled off gassing. you have a large amount of people who would under other circumstances be pushed into actual action, thinking they make a difference doing this, allowing the system to functionally ignore them.
without the media on your side these protests do not work. and the media is captured, and neither side wants to see this stop
‘actual action’ beyond protest tends to get nasty quickly. I’m glad the left wing isn’t lowering themselves to the level of, say, the capitol attacks.
The just way will take longer but it’s the only way to effect real change.
A strike would be a good middle ground though.
you say it will “takes longer” as things have been getting worse not better is a weird stance. these protests have been unsuccessful in their goals, not having a goal was the first failure. and there is a lot that can be done before the need to storm the capitol. but you are already poised to reject anything beyond protest. so you are in reality happy with the status quo
I’m not happy though I’m not directly involved as I’m not American (though I am affected of course). But there’s a limit to what you can expect here. The MAGA’s are a cult, protesting won’t touch their hard core and pushing them harder will cause escalation.
The only way these walls will come down is talking, not fighting. And they’re burning up inside now with this Iran war that’s deeply unpopular even with MAGA. Unfortunately they did manage their goal of making everyone forget the word Epstein though 😔
By protesting and being reasonable you chip away at their fringes, the people that are kinda on the fence. Anyway that’s my take.
And like I said, strikes are a good idea too, anything non violent really.
And are you actively organizing to change that? Or are you just providing an example of OP?
are you?
Yes. I’m a member of a number of local mutual aid orgs and other groups that I started working more closely with after my home state was invaded by ICE.
if that is true, then you should know what’s effective and what isn’t.
what concrete things did the no kings protests achieve so far?
If you’re writing off all liberals then your view makes sense. At our no kings the Brown Berets showed up to protect those you are spurning. Many years ago I attended a UFW march that was also protected by the Brown Berets and it shocked an out of town liberal white woman who compared the union march to the Nazis. These people tend to only see aesthetics so the march is a good opportunity to make unusual alliances. That’s the concrete achievement of my local Marxist-lennist org, but that probably doesn’t make sense to the terminally online.
here’s my own comment from just yesterday about this:
plus this is the perfect opportunity to organize to go literally talk to them. if not us, fascism will find a way to, like we’ve seen in the past so often. not all of these people are militant irreducible libs.
your misdirected assumptions and condescending tone are definitely not convincing me or anyone.
my point is: what concrete things did the liberals on the protests actually achieve so far yet? what would you do to make it more effective?
I think liberals doing trust exercises with marxists and others from different political leanings is the effective part.
Why is it always a general strike? Why not a rent/mortgage strike?
This is a pretty valid thing to say in the US.
Too many people think that just protesting is enough for any change they want to be effected. We don’t get taught about things like labor struggles.
we’ve seen no kings 1 & 2 change diddly squat, so obviously we’ll do the same thing a third time with the high hopes that nothing will change too!
Guy that is attending the useless no kings protest
You want actual change? Look at Europe on how to protest. I’m sorry for you Americans, but you got yourself in this, you gotta dig yourself out. Trump will NOT care about the o kings protest, and it’ll fade from the news within two days tops. It. Is. Not. Enough.
Protest 24/7 for months on end until the fucker is gone
Have strikes everywhere, indeed, because that it the only way you’ll get his attention and get this administration to understand that it’s over
It’s not even about how you protest, it’s about what you use protests for. You can have the best protest ever, longest strike imaginable, whatever. If you don’t have the organisation to have coherent changes and then act upon them, nothing matters. No kings, huh? What if by a stroke of magic, Trump gets scared of your rally and tries to appease the public or whatever. What’s the terms? No kings. Well, he’s not a king, he’s the president. Problem solved, continue as you were.
It’s very easy to say but you need to understand there are no labor protections in the US. Any protest during work hours result in termination.
Then get fired, all of you.
A company can’t fire all their employees, just go all protest
also known as striking.
touche
They only have to fire a few and the rest will fall in line quickly. This is why retail workers don’t have unions.
Everyone is stuck in the consumer/labor loop. One missed check is all it takes to send you to the poverty hole. Even more challenging if you have kids.
I support general strike. But I understand why people aren’t ready to do it yet. Until starving is less scary than the alternative, it’s going to be hard for them to risk that.
Yes, let’s look at Europe.
The USA is comparable to all of the EU in size, much larger than France, UK, Germany, etc. combined.
Has all of the EU ever been able to organize? France is smaller than California, one US state out of 50.
I’m sorry for you Europeans, but why do you keep supporting and enabling the USA? You continue to finance the very war machine that oppresses you (and us). Stop buying US products and stop using the US Dollar for international trade.
Go on strike yourselves and boycott, you are the experts eh? But you won’t bother, you will continue to provide our government with billions while saying “pity that”… and then complain when the USAs boot is on your neck.
Re people from the USA… MLK and peace only did so much. We need less peaceful MLK protest and more Black Panthers-style protesting. Peaceful protests are worthless alone
Go on strike yourselves and boycott, you are the experts eh? But you won’t bother
Something tells me that the US news doesn’t show much news from Europe, does it? Wouldn’t want US citizens to get the right idea on how to protest. Because fuck yeah, Europeans know how to protest and they do it all the fucking time, also about this. Doesn’t mean they are always successful, but hell they do the work. Also, the European rich class likely still remembers very well what people might do when their protests aren’t heard for too long. chop
Has all of the EU ever been able to organize? France is smaller than California, one US state out of 50.
No, but you can’t compare the EU to the US that way. We’re not EU citizens in our minds. We’re French, Germans, Polish etc. There’s very few cases where we have such a need to protest together. We don’t view ourselves as the EU people (most of us at least). And yes there were protests here today too.
And yeah the French basically invented protesting. Hardly a day goes by that some union isn’t on strike there :) They invented the yellow vests too.
Go on strike yourselves and boycott, you are the experts eh?
If you’re talking about the French then yes I would consider them the experts for sure 🤭
Stop buying US products and stop using the US Dollar for international trade.
This is in fact exactly what is happening here. It’s a slow start but big ships need time to turn. Once they’re turned however the momentum is great. There’s lots of websites with recommendations for EU alternatives, and lots of people and businesses are making plans. It’s a growing movement.
