It will have been supported for just over 10 years.
  • mrfriki@lemmy.world
    673·
    2 months ago

    Sadly it is not about learning Linux but getting the software you use on a daily basis natively supported by the OS, that is why Linux is still not there for me yet.

    • Maggoty@lemmy.world
      142·
      2 months ago

      What do you use on a daily basis that’s not supported? I see this kind of comment all the time and nobody wants to tell me!

      • DacoTaco@lemmy.world
        13·
        2 months ago

        Its almost always tools and programs used in their professional life. The 365 suite, adobe suite, fusion 360, simulation programs, …

        Yes i know there are free or alternative options, but they are never as good or powerful as the full on suites that have existed since the dawn of time.

        Ive been running linux ( dual boot with windows ) on my work laptop for 9 months at this point and i love it. But sometimes, i do have to boot windows for one of the professional suite programs.

        • Zink@programming.dev
          2·
          2 months ago

          For me the 365 suite (including copilot) all works great inside Firefox on Mint. But I work in software so the other everyday stuff is pretty well available.

          I assume some day I’ll need to boot back into windows for something, but it’s already Ben months.

        • BCsven@lemmy.ca
          1·
          2 months ago

          If you have a large work budget, then Siemens NX (version 12 or less) runs on RHEL or SUSE.

        • Darorad@lemmy.world
          1·
          2 months ago

          Fair, but in the context of gaming I doubt there are that many people gaming on their work machine.

          • DacoTaco@lemmy.world
            1·
            2 months ago

            Depends, im a power user that does all kind of things on my pc. Gaming but also other workloads, so ill be dual booting with linux as my main soon anyway.
            But for pure gaming, ye linux might do depending on the games

            • Darorad@lemmy.world
              2·
              2 months ago

              Yeah, I’ve been spoiled because most of the heavier workloads I do is all programming related and Linux tends to be better there.

              I have had issues with Autodesk products, but I’m able to get 99% of what I need with freecad.

      • overload@sopuli.xyz
        101·
        2 months ago

        Microsoft office suite? Adobe, most DAWs. PCVR.

        There are alternatives for some of these things. IMO libreoffice is good, but buggy compared to the MS office suite.

        • towerful@programming.dev
          12·
          2 months ago

          Basically “professional software” that isn’t tech related.
          There are fantastic alternatives that are (nearly) transparent for individual users.
          There are BETTER alternatives for some software.
          But working in a team/company that doesn’t prioritise Linux accessibility is painful. And it’s pain that people aren’t paid to deal with to complete their actual workload.
          MS has corporate by the balls.

          • overload@sopuli.xyz
            1·
            2 months ago

            It’s the best office suite for Linux, I just think MS office is a better product. Maybe I’m wrong and it would be great if I was more competent with it.

        • dubyakay@lemmy.ca
          63·
          2 months ago

          Honestly, I’ve just switched (after 27 years of windows) like two months ago, and I don’t miss any of that old crap. Not once have I thought “damn, wish I could have this software under Linux”, because there was always an alternative.

          Arch btw.

        • Maggoty@lemmy.world
          1·
          2 months ago

          Some people were saying MS Office will still run in the browser though and that’s 90 percent of my use case these days to be honest.

          • overload@sopuli.xyz
            3·
            2 months ago

            Yeah that’s fair. I’m very into hotkeys and macros to speed up my workflow, so the browser doesn’t do it for me.

            I do main Linux (OpenSUSE Tumbleweed), but its not a machine I use for doing serious work.

        • Mwa@lemm.ee
          1·
          2 months ago

          onlyoffice? it saldy uses chromium embedded framework tho.

      • lost_faith@lemmy.ca
        7·
        2 months ago

        I can tell you my issues, so far.

        Logitech G13 left hand kb - no drivers, Steam VR library 20 some of 90 some games come up in steam, Microsoft intellipoint trackball, only left, right, and wheel work but cannot program the other 2 buttons, no BlueStacks - simple to use phone emulator.

        Haven’t gotten any further as if VR library is not available there is no point getting rid of windows, and I really want to get rid of windows. I just don’t have the drive I used to, to fix, look up hints, tinker with my os and reinstall new ones. It has to just work. I have Kubuntu installed on a 4tb sata ssd, rtx 4070ti super, Ryzen 7 3800, 32gb ram. In the last month steam VR made some strides as setting up was as seamless as windows, but as I stated I am missing 2/3 of my VR library

          • lost_faith@lemmy.ca
            1·
            2 months ago

            I have faith steam will continue to improve proton to the point of “it just works”. As well, any new purchases of hardware will be Linux ready.

            I must say Linux HAS gotten more user friendly over the last 20/30 years, and the GUIs have gotten more stable. My first Linux distro was red hat enterprise Linux, and then I hopped around to fedora, then mandrake and mandriva, a buddy suggested slack at one point, then I found Ubuntu, and now Kubuntu, I prefer the gnome environment but kde plasma seems to work better. Wayland is also long over due.

          • lost_faith@lemmy.ca
            2·
            2 months ago

            I will keep testing and one day I will be joyous. Linux is so close, just a few more years™.

          • ProgrammingSocks@pawb.social
            23·
            2 months ago

            People love to write up laundry lists of why they can’t change. They’re fucking themselves over in the end though.

            • lost_faith@lemmy.ca
              3·
              2 months ago

              With only 20 of 90 VR games available I’d say I was already fucked over and I am nowhere near the end… Thank you for the suggestions on how to over come the issues I have so far

        • accideath@lemmy.world
          1·
          2 months ago

          For games at least (haven’t tested for films/shows as I do that on my TV), HDR support is there. I‘m running nobara htpc, which has everything necessary already set up and any game I ran in gamescope so far worked perfectly fine in HDR.

        • Maggoty@lemmy.world
          1·
          2 months ago

          Okay. I can see that being an issue. I’m fine without HDR but I know people who aren’t.

      • mrfriki@lemmy.world
        5·
        2 months ago

        I use Figma (a UX design tool). It has browser support but I prefer the native app experience, I’ve seen there are Linux versions on GitHub but I heard they have some compatibility or performance issues sometimes and I need it to be 100% reliable as it is for work. I also use some Adobe products sporadically (Illustrator and Photoshop) FOSS software doesn’t make the cut for professional use, even if they do nearly the same, since you need standard industry tools.

        I also like gaming and even though Linux is almost there (I love my Steam Deck) I see so many people struggling here and there and I really don’t feel like tinkering, I already tinker enough on Windows to get my games working properly.

        But all in all I’m still interested in Linux and keeping an eye on it and might pull the trigger some day even if is only for personal use/tinkering :)

        • Domi@lemmy.secnd.me
          2·
          2 months ago

          I use Figma (a UX design tool). It has browser support but I prefer the native app experience, I’ve seen there are Linux versions on GitHub but I heard they have some compatibility or performance issues sometimes and I need it to be 100% reliable as it is for work.

          Figma has an unofficial Flatpak version available, which is a wrapper for the web version so I can’t speak for how well it works but it might be worth to give it a try on your Steam Deck? Just search for “Figma” in Discover when on desktop mode.

          https://flathub.org/apps/io.github.Figma_Linux.figma_linux

        • Maggoty@lemmy.world
          2·
          2 months ago

          That’s where I am, I’m looking at switching my gaming computer over to fiddle with it, see what’s going on.

      • lightnsfw@reddthat.com
        4·
        2 months ago

        My biggest hangup is Fusion360. Supposedly someone figured out how to get it working but It’s not officially supported and I haven’t had time to test it.

      • gerryflap@feddit.nl
        2·
        2 months ago

        Apart from the many compatibility issues with all kinds of random games that can usually be fixed within an hour (but still cost me too much time), the biggest one is specific stuff like playing Assetto Corsa with mods in VR using a Logitech wheel. It’s already a pretty hefty stack of things to keep working on Windows, but on Linux I cannot even get AC to start so I have no idea whether the rest will work.

        I’m already fighting computers all day. When I get home tired the last thing I want to do is to fight the computer even more. I just want a game to start without issue. Even on my Steam deck I have regular hard crashes of the system in multiple games, and my PC is probably less supported due to the more random set of packages installed

    • buddascrayon@lemmy.world
      21·
      2 months ago

      Yeah, there is a whole load of Steam games that will only play on Windows systems. I’m looking forward to testing the new implementation of WINE and see if it measures up. If so, I may be dumping Windows 10 for a Linux flavor. Though I don’t know if I can get the Windows XBox app to work on WINE. So that’s a consideration.

  • Dasnap@lemmy.world
    441·
    2 months ago

    On my Windows 11 machine I just uninstalled Copilot via the normal app uninstall process. Unless I’m misunderstanding, I don’t think it’s tied into the OS in any fundamental way. I assume most debloating scripts include the step anyway.

    Kinda crap that it’s installed by default though.

      • Dasnap@lemmy.world
        182·
        2 months ago

        Gonna get to enjoy some reg edits on that machine then!

        Edit: So I just looked at that machine that is set to take all new updates, and it doesn’t look to be installed like it is for that guy in the video. However, it looks like this machine hasn’t picked up 24H2 yet, which is strange as I thought it was meant to be worldwide now?

        MS really can’t make stuff easy.

        • Lucy :3@feddit.org
          124·
          2 months ago

          Windows users trying to make their adware delivery platform strapped to a program loader usable (I can install my operating system faster then they can install a program)

          • RightHandOfIkaros@lemmy.world
            615·
            2 months ago

            Linux users trying to get a USB device that isn’t a mouse, keyboard, or data storage working on their OS (the hardware drivers don’t support Linux)

            • TimeSquirrel@kbin.melroy.org
              91·
              2 months ago

              Got an example? Because my USB MIDI music keyboard controller, smart card reader, USB guitar/mic capture device, and printer are working just fine.

              Chances are, if it’s a major brand, or following any sort of standard, it’s going to work out of the box. This used to be a problem in the 90s and early 2000s. Not so much anymore.

              • Wooki@lemmy.world
                11·
                2 months ago

                Preface: I’m now completely moved over to nixos and installing a bloody windows drive.

                NaturalPoint did some nasty stuff to opentrack and we all suffered.

                TLDR proprietary devices prefer proprietary drivers. Additionally any directX game that strains hardware pretty much requires windows or you pay in framerate. Experimental wine and proton can lose a lot of performance. Thankfully more development teams are supporting vulkan and native linux.

            • BCsven@lemmy.ca
              71·
              2 months ago

              I found the opposite. Even my obsure printer that needed tons of windows tweaks and drivers just worked on Linux.

              The only device that needed help was a 6-axis 3D mouse. Linux saw it as a mouse/tablet xy input. But Windows needs drivers for it to function. They had a Linux driver for it, so I installed that to get the 6axis working.

            • Lucy :3@feddit.org
              31·
              2 months ago

              Any devices, that do not work on any of my machines:

              Any devices, that did not work out of the box on any of my machines and needed a seperate package (I use a distro without any preinstalled drivers): Fingerprint sensor, NVidia GPU (only for gaming, it does work just not very performant)

              Any devices, that did work out of the box: Every mouse (including the PowerPlay mousepad), every keyboard, headphones, cameras, printers/scanners, touchpads, game controllers

              Bonus: Android to Linux OTG networking in both directions

              Any devices that do not work with Windows: Scanner, Touchpad (in the installer), Bonus: Intel Rapid Storage Technology

        • ODuffer @lemmy.world
          81·
          2 months ago

          If you have any anti-cheat software on your PC, then the update is paused. Basically because it fucks it up.

          • Dasnap@lemmy.world
            361·
            2 months ago

            With anti-cheat being one of the major things causing games to be Windows dependant, that is hilarious.

        • grue@lemmy.world
          32·
          2 months ago

          Imagine jumping through all those hoops because Microsoft sabotages your property against you, when your could just use Linux and have it respect your rights as its owner instead.

      • Asafum@feddit.nl
        42·
        2 months ago

        From what I understand others more knowledgeable than I am have said that person tried some nonsense where he gutted files from the OS that may have included dependencies for explorer.exe so if what Microsuck says is still true you can disable the screenshot function of recall and whatever other privacy settings you want and you’ll still be able to use your PC.

        I really hope that’s true because I honestly don’t want to have to go to Linux and play IT guy constantly when I’m just trying to play a game or something after work. However much Microsuck sucks, windows almost always just works and the rare times I have an issue so many people use windows that I can easily find a fix.

        I don’t wanna touch grass! Don’t make me! Lol

        • MotoAsh@lemmy.world
          31·
          2 months ago

          Linux isn’t that bad these days unless you want to use something silly and not supported by the manufacturers, like nVidia’s Optimus or other crap. Even then, the linux folks have it figured out. You can get step by step instructions for about any issue, even the complicated weird shit like Optimus.

    • MudMan@fedia.io
      71·
      2 months ago

      I didn’t even bother. On the machines I have with Win 11 it’s either not installed or functional but entirely optional. That whole recall feature never got implemented and honestly at this point I don’t know if it’ll ever be.

  • EldritchFeminity@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    27·
    2 months ago

    Just installed an update to 10 2 days ago to find that it had installed Copilot and put an icon for it on my taskbar. Stuff like this is why 10 will be my last version of Windows.

  • Someonelol@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    23·
    2 months ago

    Can’t wait to see what industries that handle sensitive data will do when Recall becomes an integrated part of Windows 11. They might have no choice but to migrate to Linux.

      • blindsight@beehaw.org
        12·
        2 months ago

        Exactly. Group policies give lots of control to mass enable/disable features.

        It’s one of the reasons to pirate Enterprise Windows instead of Home/Pro, so you can write your own group policies for your own device.

        • ITGuyLevi@programming.dev
          6·
          2 months ago

          Been doing that for the past 15 years or so, being able to use group policy is essential with Windows. I’m pretty sure my son really wants to upgrade his last computer (to Linux), but I may have more work to convince the wife.

          I always just bought grey market keys (for Pro/Enterprise), in nearly 20 years I never had one fail or quit working randomly.

            • ITGuyLevi@programming.dev
              4·
              2 months ago

              Because she still like the familiarity of Windows. She doesn’t do anything specific to Windows, just doesn’t want to leave it yet.

                • ITGuyLevi@programming.dev
                  2·
                  2 months ago

                  Oh they aren’t shared, he is holding out because he believes he’ll have gaming issues; my wife on the other hand, just doesn’t want to make the switch yet.

                  I probably could have phrased it better.

                  Edit: when I had said ‘his last computer’, meant that he just has one left on Windows.

      • Mwa@lemm.ee
        31·
        2 months ago

        on windows 11 the story is different its a dependency of file explorer

            • lost_faith@lemmy.ca
              2·
              2 months ago

              Thought I’d missed something, TY. Just give it time and they will integrate it if enough of us keep removing it

              • Mwa@lemm.ee
                2·
                2 months ago

                Ngl I Don’t want Microsoft to use my personal images and train them on ai I donno if they do that

  • taanegl@beehaw.org
    13·
    2 months ago

    The LSTC edition has a few more years in it… but I wouldn’t do MASS in a GRAVE… ehr, I mean - fuck.

    Look, just search for “MassGrave” on GitHub.

    • Mwa@lemm.ee
      1·
      2 months ago

      doesnt the ltsc version target enterprises and stuff and you cant just use your home/pro license you need a whole diff license and many anticheats and steam will end support for 10 once it ends support

          • taanegl@beehaw.org
            1·
            2 months ago

            LTSC is “only” available through an enterprise licensing through Microsoft or its partners, which means you can probably ask a company or organization for one of their volume keys, and will probably be the only Windows where you can permanently disable Recall…

            Like seriously, I had problems disabling telemetry in Windows 10 Pro because it kept re-enabling them, but not in the LTSC version.

            • Mwa@lemm.ee
              1·
              2 months ago

              ohhhh i thought you pay for it normally it kinda makes sense tho but yh

  • Nougat@fedia.io
    2213·
    2 months ago

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  • galileopie@lemmy.ml
    8·
    2 months ago

    Copilot is not an issue, it’s Recall that could send screenshots of all files and folders to Microsoft.

    • BCsven@lemmy.ca
      9·
      2 months ago

      Even if they don’t send data, it is a treasure trove for a hacker to get. Such a terrible idea MS came up with.

  • MeatStiq@lemmy.world
    61·
    2 months ago

    Honestly I downgraded to 10 earlier this year. Then the windows 11 update came out that boosts Ryzen performance, well my happy ass couldn’t miss out on them gains. So back to 11 I went.

    My PC is pretty much strictly used for gaming so more power is more power.

    I immediately de-bloated once I was updated.

  • Mugmoor@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    4·
    2 months ago

    Good timing honestly. The only reason I kept a Windows machine around was for gaming. Now we have much better support across the board.

  • SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world
    74·
    2 months ago

    Can’t really move to Linux if I have to make software for Windows since the majority of people won’t move to Linux.

      • KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.comM
        51·
        2 months ago

        Okay?.. like, I get the point. But you’re telling me Linux does literally nothing you don’t want out of the box? It’s like saying “Run sudo rm -rf / —no-preserve-root and see what happens on Linux.”

      • towerful@programming.dev
        2·
        2 months ago

        W10… Nothing.

        W11, some bullshit popover sidebar thing that takes up actually (Literally? Factually?) 50% of my desktop that tells me about the NASDAQ, the weather, some “local” roadworks in the next city over (when my street has roadworks blocking some significant traffic lights in the literal capital of my country), some recommendations for games, a shopping ad, and some bullshit news headlines that I don’t care about.

    • Mwa@lemm.ee
      1·
      2 months ago

      app support on linux aint half bad but definitely there is alot of professional apps missing

  • Fades@lemmy.world
    54·
    2 months ago

    Yeah because everyone knows once a company drops LTS the software becomes completely unusable!!!