To be fair, more people join the army for Healthcare or to not be homeless than for a college education. Poverty is the main driver of recruitment in the US.
In my opinion this is a reductive take on the issue. Realize that human beings can make mistakes and that not everyone understands the world the same way or even has the same knowledge.
I won’t excuse murdering innocent people, but I don’t think most people joining the US military go into it thinking “yippie time to murder innocents.”
I think most people who join have been indoctrinated (usually from a very early age) to think that the military is something it is not. While this does not excuse their behavior, it helps us to understand that the issue is not about an individuals misguided decision to join the military but rather the large scale manipulation/brainwashing of poor people. Blaming the soldier makes sense if they do something horrible or if they are truly aware of how bad the military’s actions are and continue to serve, but blaming ALL soldiers just for the act of joining is pointless because most of them don’t fully understand what is going on.
I don’t think most people joining the US military go into it thinking “yippie time to murder innocents.”
Everyone joining the army understands fully that military force is violent and involves killing people. The army isn’t some vague concept that people are getting tricked into. Violent military force is one of the most celebrated concepts in America. What the absolute fuck are you talking about?
Well I am talking about how I think most people who join the military are brainwashed.
More explicitly: yes they know that the military is about violent force, but I think most of them have a warped worldview pressed on them from a young age (often from an upbringing in a military family) that describes the situation very differently from how you or I would see it. They are indoctrinated to understand their participation in the military as a duty - both to their family and to an inner voice. I think most of them would say (when first joining) that the military kills “bad guys,” which obviously isn’t true but they have been conditioned to see it that way and much of history (especially concerning military atrocities) is omitted from their upbringing. So in my opinion your take that they are joining with the intention of murdering innocent people isn’t really accurate for most of them.
You don’t apply this logic to nazis do you? Their victims were worthy enough for you to dismiss excuses like this, but not the victims of modern imperialism. One group of victims were white Europeans, and the other group are Arab/Muslim. I see exactly who you are. You’re not slick.
Yes I do in fact apply this same exact logic to soldiers in WWII - just as it applies to many of the people who made up fighting forces in the past. There is a long, loooong history of using dogma, duty, brainwashing, even intoxication, to manipulate people into fighting to the death.
If you read firsthand accounts from German soldiers (or really ANY nationality) during WWII, you will quickly realize that they were heavily propagandized in a way we can only begin to understand today. Young German men during WWII had grown up under Nazi rule and had it drilled into their heads at every possible moment. And the choice was to conform or to be shunned (or more likely killed). This does not excuse any of the atrocities they committed, but gives context to their actions and shows how blaming only the soldiers misses a big part of the picture. The same goes for atrocities perpetrated upon the German people by the red army, or for atrocities carried out by IDF in Palestine, etc…
Also, I think you should reflect on the language you use in your comments. I am attempting to be polite, but your comments are outwardly rude.
Sorry if I’m not the kindest to a person that is defending nazis.
Also you’re framing my point as being only critical of soldiers and not the administrations that use them, which is just incorrect and a poor read of my comments. Truly insane what you’re trying to minimize right now.
there’s a difference between defending nazis and understanding how the nazi takeover worked. the banality of evil is what underlies the entire system of violence we exist in. the more people are raised not to see the evil the more they will stand idly by or go along to get along because their mind is absent of any morality. if we want to combat the nazis we need to know what strategies work to resist the colonial mindset that underpins fascism. being scolds of people locked into the propaganda doesn’t work. producing propaganda to counteract it does. and when that fails, you pick up the gun. attacking people who explain the propaganda mechanisms is not picking up the gun. it’s maintaining the divisive mechanisms that benefit the right.
We condemned and still condemn every attack on civilians who are not participant in any sort of aggression or colonialism (otherwise it will be called resistance)
That’s the difference between you and us
The Muslim world suffered the most from terrorism done by people who claim to be Muslim or doing it for Islam. Algeria was in the 90s the most affected country by terrorism by people who claim they are doing it for Islam, nobody supports when this shit is done to Europeans too.
To be fair, more people join the army for Healthcare or to not be homeless than for a college education. Poverty is the main driver of recruitment in the US.
lol, “if you lack adequate healthcare and housing, it’s understandable you would go abroad and murder innocent people.”
Absolutely insane logic, and I know for a fact you wouldn’t even entertain these excuses if the victims were white people.
In my opinion this is a reductive take on the issue. Realize that human beings can make mistakes and that not everyone understands the world the same way or even has the same knowledge.
I won’t excuse murdering innocent people, but I don’t think most people joining the US military go into it thinking “yippie time to murder innocents.”
I think most people who join have been indoctrinated (usually from a very early age) to think that the military is something it is not. While this does not excuse their behavior, it helps us to understand that the issue is not about an individuals misguided decision to join the military but rather the large scale manipulation/brainwashing of poor people. Blaming the soldier makes sense if they do something horrible or if they are truly aware of how bad the military’s actions are and continue to serve, but blaming ALL soldiers just for the act of joining is pointless because most of them don’t fully understand what is going on.
Everyone joining the army understands fully that military force is violent and involves killing people. The army isn’t some vague concept that people are getting tricked into. Violent military force is one of the most celebrated concepts in America. What the absolute fuck are you talking about?
Well I am talking about how I think most people who join the military are brainwashed.
More explicitly: yes they know that the military is about violent force, but I think most of them have a warped worldview pressed on them from a young age (often from an upbringing in a military family) that describes the situation very differently from how you or I would see it. They are indoctrinated to understand their participation in the military as a duty - both to their family and to an inner voice. I think most of them would say (when first joining) that the military kills “bad guys,” which obviously isn’t true but they have been conditioned to see it that way and much of history (especially concerning military atrocities) is omitted from their upbringing. So in my opinion your take that they are joining with the intention of murdering innocent people isn’t really accurate for most of them.
You don’t apply this logic to nazis do you? Their victims were worthy enough for you to dismiss excuses like this, but not the victims of modern imperialism. One group of victims were white Europeans, and the other group are Arab/Muslim. I see exactly who you are. You’re not slick.
Yes I do in fact apply this same exact logic to soldiers in WWII - just as it applies to many of the people who made up fighting forces in the past. There is a long, loooong history of using dogma, duty, brainwashing, even intoxication, to manipulate people into fighting to the death.
If you read firsthand accounts from German soldiers (or really ANY nationality) during WWII, you will quickly realize that they were heavily propagandized in a way we can only begin to understand today. Young German men during WWII had grown up under Nazi rule and had it drilled into their heads at every possible moment. And the choice was to conform or to be shunned (or more likely killed). This does not excuse any of the atrocities they committed, but gives context to their actions and shows how blaming only the soldiers misses a big part of the picture. The same goes for atrocities perpetrated upon the German people by the red army, or for atrocities carried out by IDF in Palestine, etc…
Also, I think you should reflect on the language you use in your comments. I am attempting to be polite, but your comments are outwardly rude.
Sorry if I’m not the kindest to a person that is defending nazis.
Also you’re framing my point as being only critical of soldiers and not the administrations that use them, which is just incorrect and a poor read of my comments. Truly insane what you’re trying to minimize right now.
there’s a difference between defending nazis and understanding how the nazi takeover worked. the banality of evil is what underlies the entire system of violence we exist in. the more people are raised not to see the evil the more they will stand idly by or go along to get along because their mind is absent of any morality. if we want to combat the nazis we need to know what strategies work to resist the colonial mindset that underpins fascism. being scolds of people locked into the propaganda doesn’t work. producing propaganda to counteract it does. and when that fails, you pick up the gun. attacking people who explain the propaganda mechanisms is not picking up the gun. it’s maintaining the divisive mechanisms that benefit the right.
in other words.
don’t be a virtue signaling shit lib.
Removed by mod
We condemned and still condemn every attack on civilians who are not participant in any sort of aggression or colonialism (otherwise it will be called resistance)
That’s the difference between you and us
The Muslim world suffered the most from terrorism done by people who claim to be Muslim or doing it for Islam. Algeria was in the 90s the most affected country by terrorism by people who claim they are doing it for Islam, nobody supports when this shit is done to Europeans too.
Comrades, is not supporting capitalist invasions the same as terrorists attacks?
Jesus Christ, listen to yourself.